Thread:Sylvandyr/@comment-5832451-20121215032807/@comment-5832451-20121217011907

Third,

Okay on to the real discussion. You say "it's not just 4-element monsters" but your 2 examples aren't quite enough to answer that. Your 2/2 match has a 3-element possibility (something more than what was put in), but the Deedge/Maw has 4/2. You say that the highest possible monster is the Deedge, but it breaks Rule #1 because of repeated elements, but then in the next sentence you say that you can't get it back because he's the highest element monster, breaking the OTHER part of Rule #1.

Here's the thing. If there are no repeats, i.e. a valid combination, then you could get back the highest element monster, or either parent (because neither parent should break rule #1). This is the normal "valid hybridization combination" scenario. But if there ARE repeats, you can't say that the way a parent breaks Rule #1 is the repeating elements part, because how does one parent repeat elements but not the other one (is it the Deedge that has the extra Water/Cold or is it the Maw?)

I think I just realized the crux of the issue. It's that the 2 examples you gave aren't quite analogous enough to say that it works for more than just the 4-element creatures.

Here's an example: Breed a Maw (Water/Cold) with a Mammott (Cold). By your rules, the highest element monster possible is a 2-element monster, but there are repeated elements. So you can't get the "highest-element monster". Then "Any of the parents that do not break rule #1" - again, both creatures break rule #1 by having a repeated element. But the Maw is the highest element monster possible. Strictly speaking, your rules say you can only end up with a Mammott.

Try it. I've gotten several Maws this way. Not as frequently as a Mammott, but it definitely happens. (Try Drumpler/Noggin if you want a quicker turnaround). In fact, early on, in order to "cycle Maws" for selling, I once tried breeding 2-element creatures by breeding a 2- and a 3-, instead of the 2- and 4-, only to get the 3 instead by surprise. I think I cycled Maw (Water/Cold) and T-Rox (Earth/Water/Cold), but it doesn't really matter - I just tried Scups and Fwog and got a Scups back.

So it's not really that you can't ever get the highest monster possible back, it's that the repeated elements makes it invalid in the first place (which goes back to BBB way back when saying the secret is to avoid repeats). If you have a 3-2 combo or 2-1 combo and there's only repeat elements, it fails, it's just people usually figure out that's not likely to get you anything if you're just matching the same elements over and over again. The ONLY time you can't get "the highest possible monster" back is if you're matching the 4-element monster with another monster, which is going to have repeats since there is no possible element that couldn't already be present. (Actually, I don't recall trying a 3/1 combo, such as T-Rox/Mammott, but I suspect you're likely to be able to get the 3 back from this situation as well, just not as often as the 1).

So when you say "it's not just 4-element monsters, it applies to ALL monsters with more than 1 element", I think this isn't actually the case - it IS only the 4-element monsters. For example, Evil Mummy said she was using the Quarrister to round out an island, because if she used a 3-element monster, there's the chance she'd get the 3-element monster back. I think it is ONLY the 4-element monster that can never be the "product" of a "failed" hybridization attempt, which would also help make them rare and hard to get. (From a programming standpoint, this is probably much easier to code, which is why I wrote the rules the way I did).